S2 Episode Nine: Letting the impact of your work guide your legal career with Lani Vinas
Full transcript follows.
Being raised in a financially struggling family in the Philippines did not stop my guest Lani Vinas from becoming a top level legal director in a law firm in Japan. Whatever you might think are your limitations, this episode will blow them all away for you. Lani tells us her story of her childhood and how her hard work combined with the generosity of others made it possible for her to be where she is today working at a premier IP firm in Osaka, Japan.
If you enjoyed this episode and it inspired you in some way, we’d love to hear about it and know your biggest takeaway. Head over to Apple Podcasts to leave a review and we’d love it if you would leave us a message here!
In this episode you’ll hear:
How Lani overcame the challenges of growing up in a struggling family the Philippines
The importance of education as a means to changes lives
How Lani came to be in working in IP in Japan
The things that Lani likes about working in IP and the impact her work has for clients
The volunteer work Lani does to help foreigners in Japan to know their legal rights
Her favourite shows, books and other fun facts
About Laarni
Laarni Victoria Quidoles Vinas (Lani) is a triple-qualified lawyer (Attorney-at-Law in the Philippines and New York and Solicitor of the Supreme Court in England and Wales).
As a Legal Director of SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO, one of the leading intellectual property law firms in Japan, she handles IP portfolios of some of the firm’s wide range of clients from the U.S., Japan, Europe, Asia and Philippines, including inventions from Nobel Prize winners, blue-chip Fortune 500 companies, national governments, globally-renowned universities, research institutes, and start-up companies. Lani’s specialization includes technology law, healthcare regulatory work, intellectual property, corporate governance and compliance, as well as data privacy.
Lani is also a lecturer in one of the most prestigious law schools in the Philippines, University of the Philippines, teaching Torts and Damages.
A fierce advocate of women’s rights and human rights, Lani supports activities aimed to close the gender parity and inequality in education and employment. She is one of the Executive Board of Women in Law Japan (WILJ) where she plays an active part in the organization’s Mentoring Program. She also volunteers for “Know Your Rights Japan”, an informal volunteer group which Lani herself founded in 2018, advocating for the protection and promotion of the individual rights of foreign residents in Japan.
As part of her academic work, she publishes articles for well-known legal journals, including Lexology, World Trademark Review, International Comparative Legal Guides and Thomson Reuters’ Practical Law. Lani also co-authored the Japan chapter of a published book entitled "Patent Enforcement the UK and Trans-Pacific Countries".
Lani’s legal and technical proficiency led her to be named as one of the finalists for the Young Lawyer of the Year Award (from 2019 to 2021) and BMW Woman Lawyer of the Year Award (from 2019 to 2020) in the Japan Law Awards of Asia Legal Business. She was also one of the youngest recipients in 2018 for Leon SA Aureus Award for her excellent and outstanding service in the intellectual property field.
Connect with Lani
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laarni-victoria-q-vinas/
Links
Know your Rights Japan: https://www.facebook.com/knowyourrightsjp/
Renegaid
https://renegaidcommunitysupport.wordpress.com/
https://www.facebook.com/renegaidcommunitysupport/
Osaka General Union
https://www.facebook.com/GeneralUnion.org
John Oliver https://www.youtube.com/user/LastWeekTonight
Michelle Obama, Becoming: https://www.amazon.co.jp/Becoming-Michelle-Obama/dp/1524763136
Connect with Catherine
Linked In https://www.linkedin.com/in/oconnellcatherine/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawyeronair
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/catherine.oconnell.148
Twitter: https://twitter.com/oconnelllawyer
Transcript
Catherine: Hi everyone! Welcome to Episode Nine in Season Two of Lawyer On Air. I'm Catherine O'Connell. Today I'm joined by Laarni Victoria Quidoles Vinas (Lani), who is a legal director at SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO in Osaka. Japan. SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO was established in 1979 and is one of the largest and most highly regarded intellectual property and technology law firms in Japan. This firm is held out as being a reflection of its diverse group of legal professionals, composed of both Japanese lawyers and foreign attorneys admitted in the New York State, England and Wales, Australia, Singapore, Philippines, and Indonesia.
The firm currently handles the most number of filings for patent and trademark applications at the Japan patent office from clients based in the US. They have also been the patent filing firm in Japan for numerous Nobel Prize recipients. Lani was born and raised in the Philippines, attending Ateneo de Manila University to obtain her Bachelor of Arts in 2004, with a major in political science and a minor in philosophy.
She graduated from the University of the Philippines, with her Juris Doctor in Law in 2011. In 2012, she studied comparative laws on intellectual property at the Osaka Institute of Technology.
In 2013, she graduated from a certificate course, intellectual property law through the World Intellectual Property Office Academy. Lani is not one or two, but a triple qualified lawyer in the Philippines, attorney in New York State, and a solicitor of the Supreme Court in England and Wales. Lani’s specialist practice areas include corporate governance, compliance and data privacy compliance.
She has also a demonstrated history of providing transactional and regulatory advice to various multinational companies in the food, pharmaceutical and healthcare sector. As a Legal Director of SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO, Lani manages a team of more than 60 lawyers, technology specialists, legal professionals, and assistants.
She also manages IP portfolios, including those inventions of Nobel Prize winners I just mentioned, as well as the portfolios of blue chip fortune 500 companies, national governments, globally renowned universities, research institutes, and high net worth individuals. Lani is a terribly passionate volunteer in the community.
She currently serves alongside me on the executive committee of Women in Law Japan. She is also actively involved in several programs for promoting the rights of foreign residents in Japan, being a really fierce advocate of women's rights and human rights and supporting activities aimed at closing the gender parity gap, particularly around education and employment in the legal field.
She also volunteers for Know Your Rights Japan, an informal volunteer group, which Lani herself founded in 2018. Know Your Rights Japan advocates for the protection and promotion of the individual rights of foreign residents in Japan. Well, the list keeps going because in 2019 and 20 Lani was one of the top five finalists for the Young Lawyer of the Year, and one of the finalists in the BMW Women Lawyer of the Year Award in the ALB Japan Law Awards.
Lani also manages to find time to teach at one of the top law universities in the Philippines, the University of Philippines, where she graduated from. And as you can tell from that introduction, Lani is certainly a lawyer extraordinaire, and I'm super pleased to bring Lani as my guest today on the podcast.
Lani, welcome to the show.
Lani: Hi, Catherine. Thank you so much for that really long introduction. I think you made it sound more prestigious than it really is.
Catherine: Well, no, that's you. That is you. And all of you, which is really incredibly amazing. So Lani, today, we're going to be talking about your career path, how you navigated your studies in the Philippines and Japan, your current legal director role, and we'll also talk about your passions for advocacy for women, legal rights for foreigners, and I'd love you to offer up some gems of advice for young lawyers on their career paths.
How's that sound?
Lani: That sounds amazing. I'd be sure to answer all of your questions as much as I can. I mean, with the limited time we have.
Catherine: That's so good. Thank you. And today we are talking online. In fact, you are in the Philippines and I am in New Zealand, currently just out of quarantine and in stage two of my home isolation as we record this. But if we were going to be meeting up in person, when we get back to Tokyo, do you have a favorite wine bar or cafe or restaurant you like to go to?
And what would you choose off the menu?
Lani: If there's one thing that I would probably meet you in, I mean, if we can travel, maybe it's not even going to be in Tokyo. Maybe I'll bring you to my hometown.
Catherine: Oh, yes. Thanks. What are we going to have?
Lani: So there's this place, it's called Red Labuyo. That's the local dialect for red chili because in my hometown in Bicol, we love spicy delicacies. This restaurant is really good. So it really goes well with the wine, and it's overlooking Mt Mayon, which is like a perfect cone volcano, similar to Mount Fuji.
It's our version of Mount Fuji.
Catherine: Wow. We also have a similar Mount Fuji in New Zealand called Mt Egmont.
Lani: Oh, really? You do? Also perfectly coned, right?
Catherine: That's actually where they filmed The Last Samurai. And so they had to make The Last Samurai atmosphere look like early Japan. So they came to New Zealand and filmed it here. So Tom Cruise came and it was all lots of fun in New Zealand.
So maybe next time they can go to your town and film.
Lani: And then go to your town and then we can also, maybe we can also meet up near your town and look at your mountain.
Catherine: For sure. So what kind of wine do you have in the Philippines? Do they make wine?
Lani: Yes, actually we do have our own version of sake. It's called lambanog, but instead of using rice, we use coconut. So that's a type of an alcoholic beverage made of coconut juice. So maybe you can have that. It's quite strong though.
Catherine: Sounds intoxicating.
Lani: It is, it really is.
Catherine: Wow. That's amazing. So Red Labuyo, we’re going there,
Lani: Yes, correct. And in front of Mt Mayon, we can have your wine with some spicy delicacies.
Catherine: Sounds so nice. Thank you so much. Wonderful. Well, Lani, I was trying to think back to when we officially met, and I think you reminded me that it was initially at the 2019 Women in Law Japan, new year's party. And then we had a few other opportunities to meet. And then when we were both nominated for Women of the Year Award in 2020, I think it was.
Lani: Yes, that's right.
Catherine: And we came across paths again then, but properly, I think our first sort of real conversations were about two years ago in January, 2020, when we had the Women in Law ex-com meeting. And you and I were both on the website and the comms committee. Is that right? Did I get it right?
Lani: That's correct. We were both, I think with Jessika, we were both in the website committee and that's how the relationship actually grew, because we would have regular meetings after that. But we first met in the Women in Law Japan, new years party in 2019. That was before the pandemic.
Catherine: Right. Yes. The good old days. But it was true, when we did that website project, we also were able to talk a lot online. Weren't we? And we talked about other things as well as the actual project. So that's a good way to get to know people.
Lani: Correct.
Catherine: Before we dive into your career, let's go a little bit back to your early days, and I know you're sort of in your hometown now, so you're probably getting a lot of visions about what you were like when you're a child, and perhaps what you wanted to be when you were a child.
I ask everyone this. So tell me Lani’s story.
Lani: I actually did not end up where I wanted to be as a child. Even as a kid, I think I was a bit ambitious. I wanted to be the president of the Philippines back then.
Catherine: Really?
Lani: Yes, people would ask me when I was like five years old and I would say, I want to be the president of the Philippians because I felt that although I have a lot of amazing and good memories as a child, when I was growing up we really didn't exactly have a very comfortable life. I would even say that we were probably a little below the normal, average family in the Philippines.
One thing that I remember before, there was a time that our apartment as a family it was bad luck because we couldn't pay for the rent.
We were outside of the house and my mom, she was very fierce. She shouted, I mean, I don't really promote this, but she shouted at the landlord to tell the landlord that they should let us in because I was seven years old or eight years old then.
So it was quite ambitious to think that you will be the president of the Philippines when you're coming from a very, very poor family.
But that's when I was made aware that the disparity of wealth, it really can make a family or even an individual powerless. And that poverty is not just economic poverty, it's really poverty of opportunity. And so it was a very difficult thing growing up, but it also gave me some insights when I was growing up, why I would want to be a lawyer and I would want to advocate for social justice and all these things.
Catherine: Oh, so it was really around 7, 8, 9, 10 that you were thinking about law then? Or you’re still thinking about this presidency role, but this sort of opportunity, I suppose, to be exposed to such an horrendous treatment that led you to be thinking about defending people's rights and becoming a lawyer?
Lani: Actually during that time, I still wanted to be a president. But when I was already studying, I think it was around nine or 10 years old, you realise that the people who are put in power, at least here in the country, they really came from affluent families. And so that started my, I think that was the reason why my dreams of going into politics went down.
And my parents, my Dad was a frustrated lawyer. So he was really pushing for me to do law. And I felt that in law you can do a lot of things. So that's when it started. I started thinking that maybe a legal career is something that's right for me.
Catherine: Oh, I see. So your dad was really a lawyer already and he pushed you.
Lani: Actually, Catherine, my dad is a frustrated lawyer. It means he wanted to be a lawyer, but because of lack of opportunity, he never became one. So he wanted all his kids to be professionals. So he wanted me to be a lawyer because he couldn't be one.
Catherine: Oh, I get it. So a frustrated lawyer. Did your other family members also become lawyers, just you?
Lani: No one, no, just me. So in my family, at least, and even on my mom's side, I was the first lawyer, I think, for maybe forever. I mean, I can think back as early as maybe four generations ago. Definitely my mom's side, I'm the first lawyer. On my dad's side, one of my uncles became a lawyer, but he was killed early on.
There's a bit of violence here in the Philippines. So I never really got to meet him. My father wanted to be one, But he never became one.
Catherine: But he must be so proud of you.
Lani: I'm sure if he's alive now, he would be,
Catherine: You know, my dad's passed away too, but I always speak of him in present tense. So I'm sure your dad is shining down upon you. Wow. That is really amazing Lani. I didn't know anything about you in that respect.
But before you went and studied law, were you working in another position or another few positions?
And so law was effectively your second career?
Lani: Yes. I started working when I was 16. The only reason why I was able to, so my dad died when I was about 16 years old. And, when he died, I had to take odd jobs. I had a scholarship. That's the reason why I was able to go to university in the Philippines. So Ateneo is one of the most expensive universities here. And I was only able to go there because of a scholarship. But of course you have other expenses and I'm the eldest in the family. So I had to provide a bit of money and help my mom as well. So I was doing odd jobs while doing university. I was a tutor for math. I used to love math. I don't do math anymore now.
I also would work during the summer, selling random things. So for instance, I would accompany my mom to sell soap, sell meat. So those were during my university days, during summer vacation, that's going to be my job. I was also a research assistant for a professor and I continued working even going to law school.
In fact, I had a one-year gap from my pre-law degree to my law school, wherein I had two jobs. I was working two full-time jobs because one of my jobs I had to save for law school. I didn't get that scholarship anymore.
Catherine: Wow.
Lani: I would sleep for, I think four or five hours a day for a whole year, because I was trying to save money.
My call center job, I would save my money from there. And then my job in the morning, which was an ad advertising association, I would contribute that to the family because two of my younger siblings, they were still studying then. So I was helping my mom a bit. I mean, my sisters were also all working when they were studying.
So we all did chip in our share.
Catherine: Wow. I think your work ethic, for example, it really fascinates me. And also I think your story could be a movie. It is amazing Lani.
Lani: You know, Catherine you'd think that it's an amazing story that I, what I have now, but if you talk to many Filipinos, you would see that some of them, they just didn't have that opportunity to study. But if they were given that opportunity, they would probably have been able to turn their lives around.
So for instance, my mom when she was growing up, she was also helping her parents and her siblings study. And my mom never graduated from university. She graduated from university the same time that I graduated from law school. So when she was finally able to do that, she felt a really huge accomplishment.
But all throughout her life, you'd see that the way that she turned things around for her, despite the lack of opportunities, it's not something that's uncommon here. You'd see it everywhere. I have classmates who grew up, I think, even in a worse off situation than me, but because of the education that they had, they were really able to turn things around.
When you say that you feel that my story is amazing, it's really not.
Catherine: Yeah. It could be representative of many people as you're saying, but I still think, I just wonder where that tenacity, that power, comes from to turn things around. How do you know you can turn it around?
Lani: Sometimes, when I look back, I think my turning point was getting that scholarship. I feel that if I did not get that scholarship, I would probably not be able to travel, I would not be able to take all these bar exams, nor meet you, or meet different, amazing women in the field.
If not for that first scholarship that I received. I think that was one of my turning points. And so I'm really thankful for the people who contributed so that I can have that scholarship. There's a lot of people who contribute to the Ateneo scholarship program. I think they do not appreciate how much impact they have on some of the students' lives. Like me. It was such a big impact that they had in my life. So I try to give back. I do have small contributions to scholars as well, because I know that it can really turn things around for that person.
Catherine: Incredible. Absolutely incredible. And hopefully there are people there who you can share this with and let them know, through what you are telling us, that you do appreciate them, and that they need to know what they do has really changed your life. That is absolutely amazing. You've got me honestly, goosebumps, the chicken bumps as they call it in Japan. That is amazing.
And so you entered the University of the Philippines to do law?
Lani: After I was able to save up enough money. So I studied for a year. The tuition fee in the University of the Philippines or UPS as we call it, it's really cheap during my time. So one year of working in a call center or BPO industry, I was able to save up for the whole four years. Of course I didn't have enough for my day-to-day, but enough already to sustain me for the next year.
So I did that and then I was working at the same time. But I think when I was about to enter second year… no, no, no, towards the end of my second year, I had a difficulty doing law school and working full time. It really was very difficult. I didn't have good grades, so I transitioned to an evening class, which is a class meant for working people.
And I stayed there until I graduated from university.
Catherine: Is It four years in the Philippines?
Lani: Four years of law school in the Philippines, but for the evening class, it's actually five years.
Catherine: Goodness me. You also had the drive to do that. I think was it the end goal that kept you going? Or what kept you going in your study at night and your working during the day?
Lani: I wanted to provide for my family. I think that's one of my driving goals. And I felt that if I'm able to finish this and be a lawyer it would, wherever I go, at least in the Philippines, you would have enough. You may not have a lot, but you would always have enough to support your family.
And so I felt that’s something that I wanted, and of course it's also my mom and my dad's wish for me to be a lawyer. So that also did push me.
Catherine: Do you think often about those days? I guess, especially now you're back in your home country, but do you think about those times often? Do they drive you now still in all that you do with your work and your community work that you're doing?
Lani: Well, it does. So Catherine, yearly I tried to organise a project to try to give back. It doesn't necessarily have to be money. It's my time, or I organise an event meant to help, or propagate education. I think that that commitment that I have of a yearly social civic activity is really because of my background.
I just plan on working until maybe I'm 50. And after that, I do want to have my own foundation. I want to have a business where 100% of the profit would go to the education of kids. That's really my end goal. So right now I'm trying to save as much as I can and invest so that I will be able to carry out that goal because I wouldn't be here if they did not give me the opportunity to study.
And I feel that if I provide that opportunity to other young women, especially young women in law, and those people would also try to do it for others, then it would really bring this world into at least a better place than it previously was in. And so that's my main plan for my career and my life legacy.
Catherine: Have you told many people about this, that you want to do your own foundation?
Lani: Yes, in the office, most of my, at least most of the lawyers that I work with directly, they know this. Most of my law school friends, because this did not start just now. In fact I have one friend, she's working in Washington now. I made her commit to make sure that if I die early, she's going to do the foundation herself.
Catherine: Okay, well, I'm also thinking, how can we help you within our respective communities, to help you through this and to get you there? That would be great to talk about with you.
Lani: Oh, yes, yes. That would be amazing. Sometimes the lack of a platform, and so I really felt that this is a great opportunity to tell people out there that if they want to help, they can sponsor. There's a lot of organisations. They don't even have to wait for my foundation.
There's a lot of organisations out there now trying to help kids or trying to educate kids. If you can touch base with them. I try to find my own scholars because I have a priority. I try to focus on those people in the lower economic spectrum. So like maybe the bottom 20% of the Philippine population or women. So our block right now, was initiated by one of my block mates in UP college of law.
They’re also sponsoring a scholar, a woman student for UP college of law. And so I think, any of your listeners, if you can try to sponsor a kid, especially for their education. I know there's a lot of other basic needs like food, but if you can sponsor them in their education, that can really go a long way.
Catherine: Sure can. Okay. Well, if there are some foundations that are coming before you set up your foundation, then let us know and we can pop them in the show notes for people to have a reference to later on.
That's amazing. It's totally amazing Lani. I'm so impressed.
And so after you've been studying, let's carry on, you went into Baker McKenzie, is that right? For your first job as a lawyer?
Lani: No, that was still when I was in law school.
Catherine: Right. Okay. So that was the job you were doing while you were studying.
Lani: Yes, correct. That was my last year of law school. I was working for Baker McKenzie. I continued doing that even after I graduated until I took the bar exam. So here in the Philippines, once you graduate you have about six months to prepare for the bar exam, and they put a lot of pressure on the bar exam in that you should pass it on your first take.
I personally do not think that that's necessary. I feel that you should take it in your own time, but because of that pressure I continued working until I think a month before the bar. After that I really filed a resignation because I needed to focus on my study, and I would study for 12 to 16 hours because I only had one month left for the bar exam.
And then the bar exam in the Philippines is four Sundays of six hours of exam every Sunday for one full month. Six to eight hours I think. So you're going to be just taking the exam the whole day for that Sunday. And it's four Sundays. With us, it was four Sundays of November.
Right after I finished the bar exam, my savings during that time was already depleted, on the Monday after my last Sunday of the bar I applied to SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO.
Catherine: Oh really? So where did you see that job advertisement for SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO?
Lani: I was actually looking for job opportunities which did not require you to be an admitted lawyer, because I just took the bar. I'm not even sure if I was gonna pass, and I had to wait, I think, until February of the next year before I would know if I passed or not. So I tried searching for opportunities for people with legal background, but without the certification yet.
And I saw one posting for SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO, I think in an Australian website, if I'm not mistaken. So I just Google searched it. And then that Australian website appeared. And then that was one of the postings there. They were looking for someone who graduated with a law degree, but does not necessarily have to have the certification.
When I looked at their website, they had a few Filipino lawyers, and so when they actually hired me, they hired me after a month of interviews and different processes that I had to go through. After a month, they hired me as a legal assistant. So when they hired me into SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO, I was hired as a legal assistant.
But before going to Japan, I had my certification. So in the Philippines I got the good news that I passed. And so they changed the role into a foreign attorney or a foreign lawyer. And that's how it happened. So that's the story.
Catherine: Gosh, you know, this is it. You just need to look, look beyond what you're thinking and things come to you. It was meant to be that you would have that position. Because you've now held it for, you've been with them since you arrived in Japan, right?
Lani: Nine years.
Catherine: Nine years. I also thought you came here and studied a little bit in Japan when you arrived as well.
Lani: You know, in Japan you have a five-day summer holiday, and then you have like a few days of annual leave. So I did not take any leave for my first year. I collected all my holidays and studied in Osaka Institute of Technology. So at night I would prepare the schoolwork because there's a bit of schoolwork before the face-to-face.
And then we had like a two week face-to-face training. So it was a hybrid online and face-to-face training that they had in Osaka Institute of Technology. I did that while I was working in SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO already.
Catherine: Okay. So I'm hearing a repeat pattern here of you being very diligent and using your spare time to be studying as well as working. And would you recommend that to other people or is it really something specific that you're able to do?
Lani: In the firm now, I was one of the first people who, while working in SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO, also took the New York bar and the UK bar. So as you know, for Japanese companies, you can't really take a month off or a year off to prepare for the exam. I did that while working. I started in 2014 and then, as you've mentioned earlier, I now have two certifications. When I started, I was one of the first, I think, but now I would say there would be maybe four people in the firm who did that as well.
Catherine: Wow.
Lani: Some of them from Australia, some of them from the Philippines. Some of them successfully took the New York bar. Some of them successfully took the QLPS to be a solicitor in England and Wales. So I wouldn't say that it's something that's special to me.
And in fact, almost everyone that I work with, I try to encourage them to do the same thing, because I really don't think that I'm special. I feel that if you just tell other people how you did it, they can do it themselves as well. They would put their own flavor or their own style in doing it, but they would also be able to successfully do it.
Catherine: Yeah, it's how you did it. Because they can see the outcome, but they can't see how you did the process, and letting them know, and not holding on to that information. Being really generous with that information and letting people know that it's totally possible, but helping them get equipped to do the same thing.
I think that's wonderful. I mean, that's what education and sharing our knowledge should be about.
Lani: Correct. It's actually a way of equalising things. If you try to hold on, and that's one thing I love about technology, it's a great equaliser. If you try to share your knowledge with people you work with, or even sometimes people from other countries, you just message them and tell them, or even gather information.
I also do that, Catherine. I would sometimes message people who were able to do something already and ask them how they did it. And so because I get that information from other people, even people I have not met, I just meet online, I try to share it with people I work with because it's just a really give and take kind of scenario.
Catherine: Right. And so how was it then back in the first few days that you arrived in Japan, were you really surprised, because that was your first country to visit outside of the Philippines?
Lani: During law school, while working, I became a representative of the Philippines for a conference in Korea and a conference in Singapore. That's actually how I learned of the legal profession in other countries. And that's what started me looking at international practice.
There's this association called, Asian Law Students’ Association or ALSA. That's the conference that I attended when I was, I think, in my fourth year, maybe third year or fourth year of law school.
Catherine: So Japan though was different to those other countries. So how was it when you arrived? You arrived into Osaka, I guess you came in through Kansai Airport and you were in Osaka. How did you feel? What were your first things that you remember at that time?
Lani: In the Philippines, we're a tropical country. When I visited Korea it was, I think, summer during that time. And Singapore also does not have winter. When I arrived it was the end of March going to early April and it was still super cold, and I have never experienced winter ever in my life.
And so I brought with me thick jackets, but I actually never thought that there's also a proper shoe or footwear when it comes to winter. And so I had these really thin socks and I was wearing, I think, doll shoes during that time. And I was walking and dragging all my luggage because it was effectively moving my whole life from the Philippines to Japan.
And I had probably 40 kilos of luggage with me and I was walking and I was thinking, Oh, wow, I think I'm going to have frostbite and my toes will just fall off, because it was super cold. That's one of the first things that I remember when I arrived in Japan, how cold it was, and Osaka is not even that cold.
Catherine: And did you have Japanese language or soon after that you learned some Japanese?
Lani: I got a tutor, but I actually never became proficient when it comes to Japanese in the office. And even when communicating with clients, I generally use English. I think that's one of my goals in the next five years to become proficient in Japanese.
Catherine: Wow. Okay. I'll keep you accountable for that.
Lani: Thank you.
Catherine: You've been at SHUSAKU YAMAMOTO for a long time now. What's the culture like there? What keeps you there? And perhaps the one or two positives you'd take away from working in this Japan environment.
Lani: I guess I would start off with saying that, there's really no perfect place to work in. It would always have advantages and disadvantages. Anywhere you go, in the Philippines, in Japan, there will be things that you like and things that you don't like. But with me, even in my previous work, one of the things that I would always look at is the impact of my contribution.
So the impact of my work. One of the biggest things I feel, or the biggest reason why I'm staying in this company is, I can see the impact of my work, not just on the pharmaceutical companies that you're helping for instance, but directly to the patients. So for instance, there's one matter that I handled wherein the biosimilar was able to be successfully launched because of our advice, and when that bioseminar was launched, it actually reduced the price of the drug to one third of the innovator drugs. And so when you try to look at it that way, when you try to look at the impact of your work, not just on your direct client, but on the greater society, you really have this passion for the work that you're doing.
It's the same thing with the mentoring, I'm sure you know, the mentoring work that we're doing in Women in Law Japan. You don't really have a huge pool of pairs. But if you, if that mentoring relationship impacts both the mentor and the mentee, then they might be able to share whatever knowledge that they have in their own circle.
And so I think one of the reasons why I'm staying in this firm is because most of the work that we're doing has impact on the lives of ordinary people. So for instance, when you try to limit or invalidate a patent, then a generic drug would probably be able to launch their product.
And so that's going to be an access to a lot of the patients. So that's how I look at my work. And I think when you look at it that way, no work is too small for you to give everything that you have.
Catherine: Right. I'm hearing you. Impact of your work. Because sometimes as lawyers, we just don't see that impact immediately or even long-term. And that can be demotivating. But you're saying you were actually seeing outcomes and the way it is impacting for good, your clients and actually people that you're working with as well.
So that's really important. Isn't it? As part of being a lawyer and attorney in this country.
Lani: For instance, if your passion is helping everyone with the work that you're doing, even if it's a commercial transaction, it may have an impact on the employees of your client. And so trying to do the best work that you can, or trying to provide them with the best service, impacts not just your clients directly, it can impact other people as well.
Catherine: Sure I get that. So aside from what you've just said, are there any other parts of your work that you really love? I'm thinking about those Nobel prize winners or the blue chips or the individuals you look after. Is there something else there with your regulatory work or the kinds of areas you're in; cosmetics, consumer products, food and bev, those areas that really make you feel very excited about what you are doing?
Lani: One of the things that I really like is when we provide regulatory advice, for instance, in labeling, and then the advice that you were giving, you will see the product on the shelf.
That's one of the things that I'm really happy about. At first, of course they won't launch the product yet, and so you will give them the labeling advice etc. And then sometimes you would see that the specific labeling advice that you provided them, when they launch the product, you will see that there's a difference in the packaging because of what you've provided them. So that's really something that I also like.
Sometimes I would actually take photos of it to remind me, when you look back on your phone. Obviously it can't be posted, especially if it's a confidential matter, but when I look back on my phone I would be able to compare it with the advice that I provided, and I would think, oh, they listened to this part of the advice.
So that's something that's exciting. And I don't feel that a lot of people or a lot of lawyers do that. That's one thing I really love about the field of work that I'm in. I also like the impact again, as I said, on the patients. I love learning about new technology. The reason why I think it is so amazing is because, it's not just law, sometimes law after five years of practice, the learning plateaus, but with IP, even with design, you would see how the technology moves.
And sometimes when it comes to technology law, it's the law that tries to keep up with the technology. It's the technology which dictates how the legal landscape would be shaped. And that's one thing I love about it. It's always exciting. You always see what's going to happen in the market before anybody else sees it.
So that's the one thing I love about the work.
Catherine: That's great. And what's your future dream for your role? I can hear the joy in your voice. So what is your future dream?
Lani: Of course there will be restrictions on how this will be implemented, but for the legal career, I really would want to see more women lawyers in our firm. Not just foreign women lawyers because we already have a lot, I also want to see more Japanese women lawyers, and I do hope that that happens soon.
In Japan, I would love to see more women lawyers in the meeting room. So usually when you have meetings with counter parties when you're negotiating, you don't see a lot of women lawyers. And I really hope that will soon change.
And there are a lot of initiatives to make sure that that happens, but I do hope that it happens faster.
Catherine: Wow. Yes. I'm totally there with you. And maybe some people hearing this would love to be working with you, foreign women, and also Japanese women lawyers coming along and being alongside you. I think they'd have a lovely time at the firm with you there. So Lani, your routine. I'm going to move to your routine and some of the things that you do to get yourself started in the morning to get up on the right foot and how you wind up your day.
Lani: So usually I start off around maybe 6:30 to 7. I wake up, then I need a coffee, two cups of coffee before I get moving.
Catherine: You're the same as me. I'm a two cup coffee person as well.
Lani: I think it also gives you the time to relax. Gather yourself before jumping off to the day. That's one thing that I like, and my partner likes putting in background music. So for my two cups of coffee, I have background music. Then I get ready for work.
I try to maybe limit my time, if I can, to 15 to 20 minutes to get ready. But usually I end up preparing for like 30 minutes. So by around a quarter to eight, I'd be out the door. and I usually don't do exercise. I think I've mentioned this before, Catherine.
Catherine: You have.
Lani: But I actually walk from my place to my place of work, which is about a 20, 25 minute walk.
So that's my exercise.
Catherine: Good. That's Good.
Lani: I cross the bridge to get to my place of work. So I walk for about 20 to 35 minutes. Then I start off my day. That's my regular schedule.
Then of course, our normal work hours now because of the pandemic starts at 10, but I try to start a bit earlier than everyone else, because once everyone else is there, there are questions that pop up that you have to deal with.
But if I start a bit earlier than everyone else, I can prepare my day and even deal with the things that I need to deal with. Especially prioritising because I think that's one of the important things that you need to know how to do, is to prioritise what you should do first and second, as the day goes by.
So I would come in about an hour, to an hour and a half, earlier than everyone else. Then 10 o'clock it's the normal workday. That would last until around seven, then things would die down around 8:00 PM. And I would, if it's a normal day, by eight o'clock I'd be going home. And then I try to have dinner with my partner, then watch a bit of a movie or watch a bit of a show. And then we'd go to bed. That's what my day would look like.
Catherine: That's a pretty long day.
Lani: It is, it is.
Catherine: I do understand that getting ahead of the day, right? Getting your edge on the day by doing your own bits and pieces that you need to do before the official starting time. I think that's probably key to being successful in what you’re doing.
Lani: Correct. I actually feel bad today that I was not able to do that earlier. Cause usually I try to be a little bit ahead, but because of the internet connection, I had a bit of trouble connecting,
Catherine: I'm sure you'll make up for it during the week or the month. It's awesome. And also Lani, I know you're very modest but you're just a shining star in the law, and you've won lots of awards and you've had publications where you've put out some interesting articles. There was one on the Hatch-Waxman Act, you know, the federal law on manufacturing drugs.
You've also won several awards and been in chambers and partners. What is it about you and awards and accolades? You seem to be a really driven person, a driven personality. You're motivated by achievement, I think, and recognition, or is it just that these things are coming to you because you've kept your head down and you've really worked hard and they've come to you?
Lani: Honestly, I think it is supposed to be a balance. After all, you still need to make sure that, especially for the firm, this is not really for me. So I sometimes do things for the firm, for us to be recognised in certain areas of law. I think it should be a balance, but the first thing that you should prioritise is to be really doing the good work, because if you do not have that good work or excellent work put in you're not really going to be recognised anyway, but eventually after you put in the good quality work, like excellent quality work, then you have to also try to submit your matters in the legal directories so that other people would be aware of the good work that you're doing. Because you know, now with the technology and with internet access available to everyone, there's just so much noise out there.
You have to learn to show that, okay, our firm is good in this particular field. So I think it should be a balance of first doing the work. There's really no shortcut to it. I think you should do the work for a few years. Excellent work for a few years first, before trying to join those submissions.
Catherine: I see. Okay. That's good advice. And then you've also, on the other side of you, you've got this volunteer work that you're doing. Maybe it's branding, but I don't think it is. It feels more to me like it's a passion, as you said earlier, to give back to the civic and social community. And I know you've obviously got your activities in Women in Law, Japan, and you've been extremely active in the mentoring group, but I only recently got to know about your volunteer work with the know your rights Japan group, which you yourself established.
Can you tell me the trigger for establishing that, and who's in the group, and what activities you do, and how this community of Lawyer on Air may be able to help you?
Lani: We're a very small group. In fact, most of the volunteers come from people in the office, because as you know in the office there's a lot of foreigners there. The reason why we organised this group is because there's a lot of misinformation regarding employees’ rights, especially foreign employees’ rights in Japan, foreign residents in Japan.
And so we felt that, this is how it started actually, we felt that we needed to educate foreign residents in Osaka about their legal rights. And so what we did was we invited a few lawyers and a union in Osaka, there's a general union in Osaka who also volunteered, and we provided, it's not really legal advice, but it's more of a seminar.
It was face-to-face then. I think we had about 50 people who attended the event and they would ask questions. And what we did was we also got interpreters from different countries. So that if someone doesn't speak English or Japanese, then they can ask their questions through the interpreter and the interpreter would ask the lawyer.
So that was the set up, I think it lasted for maybe an hour or two hours. That's how it started. The event happened in 2019, I think early 2019.The 2020 event the pandemic happened. And so we had just information dissemination and some people would contact us if they're having, actually the type of work it originally started with, employee's questions.
But now we've been receiving requests in relation to domestic violence, even kidnapping. And so what we do generally is we just try to connect them to the correct NGO who can help them because we really don't have the capacity to handle those types of things.
So we try to connect them to the general union for labor matters or there's this group called the Renegaid, it's an NGO in Osaka, and they tend to help people if they're having trouble with domestic trouble, like filing reports to the police and they don't have the capacity to communicate in Japanese. So the Renegade community's also helping us with that.
So the work that we're doing in know your rights is more of a middleman and just connecting them to the correct organizations.
Catherine: But let's get some more information about these out there. And so let's put some in the show notes today, but also through Women in Law Japan. I can see us putting a site where we can have people come and find all this information as well, and help you in some way to make sure that people do know where to go, because that's the hardest thing is finding out.
And recently we've had a lot of inquiries to women in law, Japan, about similar questions, and I think it would be good to compile them all together and have a resource that people can go to, using and helping know your rights, Japan as well. Thank you so much for that. It's just amazing and wonderful work that you're doing there too.
Lani: That's actually a great idea, Catherine, I think. So right now we're mostly catering for people in Osaka. But putting it in the Women in Law, Japan website would probably help more people and would probably cover more scope.
Catherine: Hm, I think so. And so let's try and do that. Well, Lani, I'd love to ask you for your advice for young lawyers because you're not an old lawyer yourself. You're a young lawyer in my book, and I'd love to know the things that you would be able to tell other young lawyers as they're coming up now.
Are they supposed to do technology? Are they meant to be volunteering and networking? Are they meant to be doing all kinds of other things? What do you think would be really good advice, wisdom for young lawyers and law students coming out and starting their careers?
Lani: I think you will never go wrong with having grit really, that's the one thing that should be learned even before you become a lawyer, like growing up, it's something that a person should have. I read somewhere that grit is a combination of passion and perseverance. And for me, the passion there is not doing something that you're already passionate about. It's developing passion for the work that you're going to do. So for young lawyers, you should learn to have passion on the matters that you're handling, passion for your clients, passion for your specific matters, because some people, they don't have the luxury of following their passion.
And so if you end up doing legal work, for instance, you should try to be passionate about the work that you're doing. I would also probably say that when you're doing your work, you have to be thoughtful and know the impact of your action or impact of your contribution.
That's really something I feel that helped me care more about the things that I'm doing. And I guess, finally I would say, make sure that you have time also for yourself. I mean, you have to take care of yourself, even though you're trying to be more compassionate or be more passionate about the work that you're doing, you should always have time to take care of yourself as well.
Catherine: Great, great tips. And I know, as we're stepping into 2022 Lani, there are also many things that you will be thinking about for your 2022. And if you have some more tips and advice for inspiring lawyers as they plan their career and personal development activities in 2022, what would they be? These can be any kinds of lawyers, lawyers at our level, who are mid-career, maybe even those who are beyond us, who've got more years ahead of us.
What would you think would be things to be thinking about in 2022?
Lani: Always try to find a new skill to learn. There's so much, so many things out there. So many skills to learn, which would not just help you in your career, but also help you in your life. So for me, for 2022 I really do want to start taking my Japanese lessons seriously.
I feel that it's going to improve my life in Japan as well as my career. So if there's one thing that I would tell, not just younger lawyers, or lawyers in my level, or even people who are towards the end of their careers, or actually not even lawyers, learning a new skill is always to your advantage, I feel, and to the advantage of the community around you.
Catherine: Brilliant. That's brilliant. And Lani, is there anything else that we didn't cover today that you wanted to mention, or that you did talk about but want to re-emphasise?
Lani: If people from the California Alumni Association are listening right now, they're one of the people who chose me as their scholar when I was in university, I really do want to express my gratitude to them. That's the one thing that I feel I should specifically mention.
I'm not sure if that organisation still exists now, because that was maybe 15, 16 years ago, but I just want to express my gratitude to them.
Catherine: Lovely. Let's find out and we'll find out if people are still around from that organisation and let them know that you've been on the podcast today. Thank you so much. Well, Lani, we're going to finish up with the final super six, which is a quick fire round of six questions that I love to ask every guest for winding up the interview.
And so the first question is if I had a million yen in cash to give you, where would you spend it? It can be the Philippines as well, or Japan, your favorite store or destination, or maybe it's a social cause in your case.
Lani: I would get maybe 10 scholars for university, whatever they want to study, and I would sponsor them until they graduate university.
Catherine: Wow. Yes, I knew that was coming. All right. How about a book or a podcast that you are listening to, or have read or listened to recently that you could recommend?
Lani: I don't really have a staple podcast that I listen to, although I have been listening to yours, but usually in the background. Yes. I mean, I've been listening to yours. One of the amazing things for me was Aramide’s, and I also loved Mindy’s.
In the background, I love listening to political comedians.
So I liked listening to John Oliver's. So I just put him in the background. It's not actually a podcast because there's a video there, but I treat it like a podcast. I just put him in my pocket. And then, I mean, I put the phone in my pocket and I just listen to what he has to say. So that's the one thing that I listen to generally when I'm walking, but otherwise I listen more to music, especially musicals.
Catherine: Hmm. Musicals. Oh, I see. Okay. That's interesting. What about a favorite saying that you have a mantra or something that you live by?
Lani: I would say that it's that luck is defined when perseverance meets opportunity.
Catherine: Mm.
Lani: No, no, no. It's actually preparation meets opportunity. Luck is defined as when preparation meets opportunity, I believe that. There is no such thing as luck.
Catherine: Hmm. That's very deep. And Lani, is there a famous person or celebrity you would love to meet or have already met?
Lani: I would love to meet Michelle Obama.
Catherine: Yes.
Lani: I would love to meet her. There's a lot of things about her that I would love to learn from. So actually for the holiday break, I'm going to be reading Becoming for winter break.
Catherine: I was going to ask you if you've read it. Yes, I read it at the beginning of last year, 2020. I read it just as we started the pandemic. It's absolutely amazing. You're going to love it.
Lani: Oh, okay. I'm really looking forward to it.
Catherine: The thing is you hear her voice in your head as you're reading it.
If you imagine her voice saying the words. Yeah. And I think she does have an audiobook as well. So you can hear her read those words to you as well.
Lani: It's such an amazing thing. I know the history that they had, and for me, it's such an amazing thing the way that she developed into, she's also a success. She's a success story. So I love hearing about people who you just do not expect becoming something that big and it's breaking the glass ceiling, I guess. I would love for her to be the president of the United States. I know that she's really not into politics and she does not want that role, but I do hope that eventually she reconsiders it.
Catherine: Hmm, that would be amazing. Amazing. All right. I'm going to ask you what's on your bedside cabinet in your house that inspires you, and why?
Lani: In my house in Japan, I would have the book of Adam Spencer. It's called the big book of numbers. As I said before, I loved math. And so now I'm slowly reading that. What he does is he would count from one to 100 and provide you with interesting trivia about a specific number.
So it's something that I really enjoy reading. It's my nerdy passion.
Catherine: Sounds fun actually. Even though I'm not a math person, it sounds like lots of fun. And the last question, Lani, I think we may be at six now, is the thing about you that people don't know. You've told me a little bit today about you that I didn't know, but something about you that a lot of people do not know about you.
Lani: The one thing that not a lot of people know about me was, when my dad passed away, he was actually misdiagnosed. And when I was studying, I realised that the misdiagnosis, the case for that, already prescribed, and this is the one thing that not a lot of people know about my history.
And so I feel that the reason why I wanted to share this is, this is for all the lawyers out there. If you can spare a bit of time to talk to some people needing legal help, I would really love it if you spend time with them because it can change their lives.
So that's one thing that not a lot of people know that the action prescribed because I was not able to reach out to any lawyer with a capacity to advise me properly on that matter.
Catherine: Mm, goodness me. I think that's good advice to be leaving us with on the podcast today. Thank you, Lani. Well, we have come to the end, unfortunately. You really have had such a solid career, niching down, or niching down as our US friends say, in IP law and compliance and regulatory. And it's very clear that you are leveraging this amazing vivacious personality and your culture and experience, and this background to give back to the community and all of these social and civic responsibilities and activities you've had in the community.
You've really shared an amazing story today with your insights and nuggets of advice. And it was so great to connect with you in this way. Thank you so very much.
Lani: Thank you very much, Catherine, for having me. I don't think I say this often, but you really are an inspiration. I mean, I would want to hear more about how you developed your career, especially how you decided to be an entrepreneur in Japan. I mean, I'm sure you know what I'm talking about, how women, well at least before, are treated as second class citizens in this country.
Catherine: I will tell you that another day. So Lani, how can our legal eagle listeners and other aspiring lawyer extraordinaires like you connect with you? Would that be on LinkedIn or is there another social media way to get hold of you?
Lani: Yes, that would be LinkedIn. They can just drop a message. I generally check that. So usually it’s on LinkedIn.
Catherine: Okay. Well, fantastic. We'll put that in the show notes. And so anyone who's interested in connecting with you can reach out to you.
Great. Well, I'll finish up there. We've had a fantastic conversation about so many different things. I'm really grateful to you for being my ninth guest in this season two of Lawyer on Air.
And I want to thank you for your honesty and openness. It's been really amazing to listen with you. And so to all my listeners, please do like this episode and subscribe to Lawyer on Air, and do drop us a short review as it really helps Lawyer on Air be seen by many people. You can also go to my web page and leave me a voicemail and tell us what you thought about the episode and the guest that we spoke with.
So do go ahead, share this episode with another legal eagle and someone who you think will enjoy listening to it and be inspired to live a wonderful lawyer extraordinaire life.
That's all for now. See you on the next episode. Cheers, kampai and bye for now.
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